Talk:LGBT pride

Pride Terminology origins

The sources that Brenda Howard, Robert A. Martin, and L. Craig Schoonmaker had anything to do with the word "pride" are quite dodgy or non-existent. It looks like Howard had less to do with the use of the word pride and seem she may have been more about being one of the founders of Christopher Street Liberation Day. Are there more reliable sources and details for the claim they had anything to do with inventing or popularizing the word "Pride"? Myotus (talk) 18:19, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

Page move reversion

So the page was moved back to LGBT pride. Which is fine. People are allowed to disagree. I just wanted to share my opinion, however, that another RM is likely to eat up a lot of time, and I'm not sure it's going to result in a different outcome anyway. LGBTQ seems to be the most popular term IRL and on here, even if LGBT pride is more popular via Ngrams.

Personally, I think we should just move the page to LGBTQ pride per WP:CONSUB so we can all move on with our lives. That said, if people really want to relitigate the whole thing again, then please ping me. Lewisguile (talk) 11:43, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

@Raladic You may want to do another RM here, given that this has been reverted? Lewisguile (talk) 16:26, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

@Lewisguile see below, it took some research of the last move discussion to understand how the article ended up here.

I think following this, it's pretty clear that yes, the article should be moved. Raladic (talk) 19:34, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

Sterling work. In that case, we may see a WP:SNOWBALL here and can resolve this quickly enough. Lewisguile (talk) 06:57, 25 September 2024 (UTC)

Requested move 24 September 2024

LGBT pride → LGBTQ pride – The page was moved from Gay pride to LGBT pride a few years ago in recognition that this article is about Pride of the community, not just exclusively the Gay community, despite the term Gay pride still being higher in use than LGBT pride was at the time, so the consensus for the article was explicitly to deviate from exclusively applying WP:COMMONNAME as a compound word in the move in 2022 in recognition that the true common name nowadays is just Pride without any qualifiers. Now as a followup some years later, I propose we move it to LGBTQ pride in recognition of the community continuing to evolve and explicitly adding the Q as was also recently done in the main article LGBTQ (RM discussion) in recognition of LGBTQ replacing just LGBT. The person that contested the bold move argued that WP:COMMONNAME applied, but as I pointed out, this article is already not named in line with strict common name of the combined term, but in recognition of the community as the true common name today is simply "Pride" (in line with the sibling articles Pride Month and Pride parade, which doesn't need a qualifier, so no suffix or prefix is needed to disambiguate) without any qualifiers, but since the article requires a qualifier to differentiate it from just the English word Pride, it was then decided to add LGBT for it, which was the common name for the community at large at the time, consistent with the parent article, which was also LGBT at the time and instead of using Pride (LGBT) it was decided to use LGBT Pride per WP:NATURAL to use a prefix, not a suffix, so the current article title should not be interpreted as a compound word, but instead is just a natural combination instead of suffix disambiguation. Following this now, I believe means we should continue to now also follow WP:CONSUB for consistent titling of sub-articles related to the parent title. This is also supported if we combine LGBTQ pride and Queer pride, which is about double that of just LGBT pride per Google Ngram and this also shows that LGBT pride is on a downwards trend since 2017, while LGBTQ pride and Queer pride both are on an upwards trajectory, both individually, as well as combined having overtaken just LGBT pride since 2016. The other alternative would be to break from the natural title disambiguation and call the aticle Pride (LGBTQ) in recognition that the name of the article is just Pride and that the prefix or suffix are just disambiguators from Pride (disambiguation) terms. Raladic (talk) 19:13, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support LGBTQ pride. Per Ngrams, LGBT pride and LGBTQ pride were essentially tied two years ago, with LGBT pride on a downward trend and LGBTQ pride on an upward trend. Per the WP:COMMONNAME policy, when there is no single, obvious name that is demonstrably the most frequently used, the name should be selected by applying the listed principles. The relevant ones for distinguishing between LGBT and LGBTQ here are consistency with other articles (particularly LGBTQ) and precision (the article includes, rather than excludes, queer individuals in its scope).--Trystan (talk) 20:07, 24 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Pride (LGBTQ culture) There is no overwhelmingly common wording of this that can be used per WP:NATURAL, so a disambiguation should still be used here in order to ensure better agreement. Looking at the previous move discussion, I am surprised it did not close as "no consensus", as the proponents of the current name were largely just voting for it while ignoring arguments to the contrary, but that may have had to do with the dubious non-admin closure. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 06:22, 25 September 2024 (UTC)

  "The current name" meaning LGBT (as per this article) or LGBTQ (as per the category RM that kicked off this discussion)? I think most people making a !vote for LGBTQ were actually basing it on evidence (changing usage of LGBTQ versus LGBT), whereas most of those opposing it did so because they thought queer was offensive/a slur, but I couldn't see a commonly cited policy for that other than WP:IDONTLIKEIT. There weren't really any policy-based reasons to stick with LGBT, once Ngrams showed it was on a downward trend. Lewisguile (talk) 06:57, 25 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support LGBTQ pride. Would also accept Pride (LGBTQ culture), however, since most people do just call it pride (but a similar suggestion was declined in 2022). I strongly oppose LGBT pride for the reasons given above by Raladic and Trystan, including WP:CONSUB, but also because it's not future-proof. Lewisguile (talk) 06:53, 25 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support. The common name seems to be LGBTQ pride. JIP | Talk 08:12, 25 September 2024 (UTC)